Aug

3.2 DK Spec Updates for PvE DPS

Posted by: Skeleton Jack in Specs

Heya guys!! The tallies have been finally coming in, so lets look at the top performing DK DPS specs available eh?

2H Unholy Obliterate – 0/17/54

Unholy has three possible builds. There is DW Unholy, SS Unholy, and OB Unholy. Now while OB Unholy is the clear winner, it does not make DW Unholy or SS Unholy no longer viable. You can still use those specs in a raiding environment and do well. Just not as well as OB Unholy will.

Rotations

PS -> IT -> BS -> BS -> OB -> DC -> DC (10.5 sec)

OB -> OB -> OB -> HoW -> DC -> DC (9 sec)

Priority System: Diseases (BP > FF) > MaxRP-Dump > OB > BS > DC

As you run into any fight you should have tried to build up some RP before hand (you only need 5RP to start) through DnD, HoW, and other available means. If you do not, you will not have enough RP to fire off the last DC in the first 10 second rotation.

MaxRP-Dump means that if you will hit your RP cap (and therefor lose RP), then you should fire off a DC immediately instead of a Rune attack. Outside of that, Rune abilities always take priority over RP abilities.

Always keep the 2SR in mind as you will want to fire off DC’s and HoW at odd times when your rotation gets messed up. Summon Gargoyle, movement, and boss abilities can throw a rotation off quickly. Intelligent use of the 2SR will allow you to overcome that.

What comes first, the rotation or the priority system? While ideally it’s easier to follow a rotation, a priority system will in the end lead to more dps. Sometimes rotations just get messed up.

Runeforge: Rune of the Fallen Crusader

Sigil: Sigil of Virulence

Weapon Speeds: Slow

Presence: Blood Presence

DW Frost - 0/53/18 & 3/51/17

Frost has evolved into the DW (dual wield) tree for Death Knights mainly due to the talent Threat of Thassarian. While there is a viable DW Unholy build, Frost DW is the clear winner for 3.2 release. While you could do a 2H build for Frost, it will not compare to a DW Frost build.

3/51/17 is the best DPS spec, however if you find that you need to provide IIT to the raid then 0/53/18 is the next best option.

0/53/18 Rotations

IT -> PS -> BS -> BS -> OB -> FS -> FS (10.5 sec)

OB -> OB -> OB -> HoW -> FS -> FS (9 sec)

3/51/17 Start Rotations

IT -> PS -> BS -> Pest -> OB -> FS -> FS (10.5 sec)

OB -> OB -> OB -> HoW -> FS -> FS (9 sec)

3/51/17 Rotation once diseases are on the target

OB -> BS -> Pest -> OB -> FS -> FS (9 sec)

OB -> OB -> OB -> HoW -> FS -> FS (9 sec)

Priority System: Diseases (FF > BP, or Pest) > KM Rime > MaxRP-Dump > OB > BS > FS

KM Rime is when you have both a KM and a Rime buff on you at the same time. At that point you should fire off a HB before you do anything else.

MaxRP-Dump means that if you will hit your RP cap (and therefor lose RP), then you should fire off a FS immediately instead of a Rune attack. Outside of that, Rune abilities always take priority over RP abilities.

Always keep the 2SR in mind as you will want to fire off FS’s and HoW at odd times when your rotation gets messed up. Movement and boss abilities can throw a rotation off quickly. Intelligent use of the 2SR will allow you to overcome that. Always remember that if you are forced to stay at range from a boss, firing off a DC can still be a good thing.

What comes first, the rotation or the priority system? While ideally it’s easier to follow a rotation, a priority system will in the end lead to more dps. Sometimes rotations just get messed up.

Runeforge: Rune of the Fallen Crusader / Rune of the Fallen Crusader *or* Rune of the Fallen Crusader / Rune of Razorice

Sigil: Sigil of Awareness

Weapon Speeds: Slow/Slow

Presence: Blood Presence

Notes: FC/RI is a far superior Runeforge setup for dps in any encounter where you’re basically sitting on one target for over a full minute. However when you get into constantly swapping targets, FC/FC becomes superior for it’s lack of needing to stack debuffs on a target. Basically this comes down to the type of encounters you will be facing.

2H Blood - 51/0/20

If you played 3.1 Blood, then you’ve played 3.2 Blood. It’s basically the same beast.

Rotations

IT -> PS -> HS -> HS -> DS -> DC -> HoW (10.5 sec)

DS -> HS -> HS -> HS -> HS -> DC -> DC (10.5 sec)

Priority System: Diseases (BP + FF) > MaxRP-Dump > HS > DS > DC

Always keep the 2SR in mind as you will want to fire off DC’s and HoW at odd times when your rotation gets messed up. Dancing Rune Weapon, movement, and boss abilities can throw a rotation off quickly. Intelligent use of the 2SR will allow you to overcome that.

What comes first, the rotation or the priority system? While ideally it’s easier to follow a rotation, a priority system will in the end lead to more dps. Sometimes rotations just get messed up.

Runeforge: Rune of the Fallen Crusader

Sigil: Sigil of the Vengeful Heart

Weapon Speeds: Slow

Presence: Blood Presence

Note: I am not a fan of Blood Worms as it will eat up AoE healing in a raid. It can lead to raid deaths, or unnecessary pressure on healers. Because of that I spend the typical 3 points in BW into defensive/utility talents since there are 0 available dps talents available at that point. YMMV.

Other Useful Info

If you’re looking for other specs, or older spec info see: Live 3.2 Death Knight Specs: DK DPS, Tank, and PvP

If you’re looking for answers to popular questions about specs see: 3.2 Questions and Answers by SJ, Part 1 & 3.2 Questions and Answers by SJ, Part 2

If you just want solid DK resource information:

Best in Slot Items – This page has listings for all T7 and T8 itemization currently. It breaks the gear down into 6 different categories depending on your current hit and expertise ratings. Highly useful for picking your gear out from instances..

The Two Second Rule, 2SR – This page explains the mechanics behind the 2SR. As a DK it is paramount that you understand how this mechanic works to take advantage of all of the tools you have available.

Hit and Expertise Revisted – Most people don’t actually understand how Hit and Expertise come into play for a DK. Or even what the caps are, or what they mean to you. Here is your post. Caps, ratings, etc. It’s all here.

Blood Tap – Most DK’s never use this ability, but it’s actually key to many specs. If you have any 1 Rune special abilties in your spec such as Vampiric Blood, Ghoul Frenzy, Bone Shield, and Unbreakable Armor then you need to read this post to see how you can use BT once a minute to fire these off without messing your rotations up ever.

Death Knight Macros – I need to go back and revamp this page. Make better headings, better names, categories, etc… But if you don’t mind pilfering through it, it’s still got some decent macros in there to use.

-Suffer Well Brothers and Sisters.

Tags: Specs

This entry was posted on Monday, August 10th, 2009 at 9:03 pm and is filed under Specs. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

92 comments so far

NegativeZero

I feel like I’m missing something. How is the Frost DW 3/51/17 ongoing rotation you’ve listed possible? HoW is on a 20 second cooldown but there’s only 12 GCDs being used between each HoW, meaning that it’s going to still be on a 2-second cooldown unless you manage to get a Rime proc every rotation and work in a HB, or some other GCD.

August 10th, 2009 at 10:24 pm

Cotopaxi

I’d like to ask again where you came up with bloodworms being detrimental to a raid as far as eating AOE healing. The only thing I can figure you are referring to is Chain Heal which the Bloodworms wouldn’t hardly ever get because most damage one shot KO’s them. Also in doing research on the subject I’ve seen nowhere anything but rumor that they actually eat the healing.

August 10th, 2009 at 10:24 pm

Knever

i am using the 3/51/17 build… I have a question, why are we taking Hungering Cold? Maybe I am missing something I just can see the absolute need to take that talent for the build. Thanks!

August 10th, 2009 at 10:50 pm

Skeleton Jack

How is HoW being used every 20 seconds? Simple, because it’s 20 seconds. Your runes are on 10 sec CD’s. Do the math.

Blood Worms eats healing. I’ve seen it in raids. I’ve listened to my healers bitch about it. And they don’t always get instant KO’d.

Hungering Cold is optional. You get like 5 points to spend that can go anywhere, but not in dps talents. You want Chillblains or Reach instead feel free.

August 10th, 2009 at 11:00 pm

Knever

So the same with IFP I assume… b/c again, the stam buff wont really matter much with my raid…

Thanks for all you do!

August 10th, 2009 at 11:54 pm

Deathñdecay

looking though months of WWS reports. Bloodworms Eat the following heals

*Judgement of Light
*Circle of Healing
*Wild Growth
*Glyph of Holy Light

August 10th, 2009 at 11:56 pm

Knever

Disregard previous I see my own error

August 10th, 2009 at 11:57 pm

RueRyuzaki

So What Gems should i be Using for Frost DW… Spell Pen > Str?

August 11th, 2009 at 12:00 am

N006

0/17/54 spec is better than 3/13/55?

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0300000000000000000000000000320050003000000000000000000002302303040032152003150003133051&glyph=271808060501&version=10192

August 11th, 2009 at 12:57 am

Kodama

In the 3/51/17 build Jack, why would you take hungering cold and frost presence instead of 3 points in Icy Talons? Does this mean that haste isn’t very important for dual wield builds? Any help would be appreciated.

August 11th, 2009 at 2:24 am

mystta

HoW is howling blast?

August 11th, 2009 at 4:02 am

Noir Mort

The 3/51/17 spec is interesting. I will miss unbreakable armor but I will not miss it scrweing with my rotation and 2/3 BCB(2/3 aint bad). However, subverision is well worth it. The only change I would make to increase DPS would be to take the points out of IFP and put them into Endless Winter. It’s the only talent out there even though situational that would actually increase DPS(except IFP keeping you alive I guess). In doing this you can use Mind Freeze for free! No runic power spent on interrupting spells on bosses and it isn’t on a global cooldown, so more FS without losing anything. Again situational but that’s better than nothing right?

August 11th, 2009 at 4:44 am

Pwnisher

HoW is Horn of Winter, but perhaps HB (howling blast) was intended?

August 11th, 2009 at 4:49 am

Deahtoknight

Do you have any idea which tree is out performing the others? For example, is Blood beating our 2h OBL Unholy but that beating out DW Frost.

August 11th, 2009 at 5:58 am

Deahtoknight

BTW I really appreciate your hard work! Thank you

August 11th, 2009 at 6:05 am

asscobra

heya jack, was wondering a lil why IFP is in the 3/51/17, and also why the dps is higher fromthat spec than from 0/53/18 i thought we actually gained from being hasted ?? or are you making up for it with gear ?, a lil deeper explanation of these 2 frost dw builds would be awesome, also in the 0/53/18 spec you have 5/5 killing machine and skipped unbreakable armor ?, does that yield a higher dps ?. im sure more than me would appreciate it, respecs are starting to get expensive here haha

oh one more thing, would you say a 20% ArP is enough for these builds ?

August 11th, 2009 at 6:26 am

Demilich

I check your sight pretty much everyday. A few days ago I noticed what you said about the 51/0/20 being superior to the 50/0/21. I then went back to it again for awhile, however my dps seemed to drop 2-300 on average. Also dropped about 500 on most bosses. I went back to the 50/0/21 build and am using the glyphs of dark death/unholy blight/death strike. Its difficult to tell if the ub one is working and I know you said it wasnt. Wondering though if maybe the 51/0/20 build grows better with gear (mine isnt that great and im only pulling 5400 on a good boss fight)? Also im keeping the unholy blight up in priority over the melee skills and am wondering if that makes a difference?

August 11th, 2009 at 6:32 am

Axhell

I’ve heard on Elitist Jerk that the Unholy 2h OB is only superior to SS after a certain number of armor pen. What’s the magic number ?

Since i’m only geared in Ilvl200-219, my guess would be that a should use the SS spec.

Thx

August 11th, 2009 at 6:54 am

Ebonyeyes

Hey, as for the 0/17/54 i found that this rotation works best for me:
PS, IT, BS, BS, OB, HoW, DC, DC
OB, OB, OB, DC, DC.
Before the first RP dump you get 85 RP, 3x OB gives 75 so thats exactly the amount for 4x DC and you don’t have to use anything pre fight to generate extra RP.

August 11th, 2009 at 7:49 am

Skeleton Jack

Heading out to work, will answer questions late afternoon/early evening (CST) after I’m off and finished working out.

August 11th, 2009 at 9:28 am

Dfesta

Hmmm…I was checking the new DW frost spec and I was thinking if isnt better move the 2 points of improved frost to Icy Reach. Im not sure, but that talent dont affect the area dmg of HB?

August 11th, 2009 at 9:52 am

Rick

If you say the runes attacks are the priority in Runic Power attacks, why Sigil of the Vengeful Heart is better than Sigil of Awareness? just a doubt i never tried the Sigil of the Vengeful Heart

thx for tall info you bring to us

August 11th, 2009 at 10:16 am

Knever

@asscobra

its not that you really “skip” unbreakable armor but that you have to spend points elsewhere to get to the lower tiers without going all the way to IIT… since unbreakable does mess up your rotation a bit and the damage increase from it is more than made up for with subversion etc… you skip and save the GCD/ rotation mess up….

Another thing to keep in mind is that Jack already stated that when you dont have to provide the haste buff to your raid they 3/51/17 is better…

Someone asked if haste was important…. it is but not worth the talent points if other raid buffs are just going to override it

Dont use spell pen when playing a DK

August 11th, 2009 at 10:17 am

Pwnisher

Fellow DKs – Please read all previous posts dating back at least one week. SJ puts a ton of work into this for us and continues to get the same questions over and over that are answered in previous posts. We need SJ concentrating on new research, not repeatedly answering the same questions. He takes the time for us, let’s take the time for him! Peace, and happy killing

August 11th, 2009 at 10:48 am

Deathnyhte

I use mostly strength gems how about eveyone else? 3/51/17 build

August 11th, 2009 at 10:50 am

Axhell

Good advice Pwnisher, i just looked back at previous post and found the answer for my Armor Pen question:

“However Unholy will scale best with OB once you have T7/T8+ itemization, though 18%+ Armor Penetration makes it ideal. SS will soon no longer even be used by Unholy specs unless Blizz changes something.”

So I’ll wait untill i’m at least at 16-17% before considering the OB spec.

August 11th, 2009 at 11:07 am

Knever

Thank you pwn, was debating writing that myself… Read all the posts from the last 10 days! They have big “headers” so you can easily skim to the information that pertains to your spec and/or playstyle

August 11th, 2009 at 11:47 am

Chillax

I’m not really sure how effective it is, but I’ve been using the 3/51/17 while still keeping the talents to get Icy Talons.

Though it’s true that Icy Talons can’t be up all the time, I can still keep it up for 1/3 of the fight by popping Blood Tap, Icy Touch after I use obliterate on my deathrunes.

It doesn’t mess up the rotation much at all and gives the raid and myself a slight buff while keeping the 3/51/17 spec.

August 11th, 2009 at 12:00 pm

Cerpintaxt

I find BCB and IFP to be worse than taking Unbreakable armor and IIT. IIT (3/5) helps in heroics or 10 mans without WF etc and it is a dps upgrade over IFP and 2/3 BCB, i think. I also took CE because its fun and because 1/3 BCB seems too weak (and not so fun =D). And hungering cold seems cool to just apply the frost disease quickly so i didnt take that.

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0300000000000000000000000000320053303520031023000331013512302003050010000000000000000000&glyph=181312060501&version=10128

August 11th, 2009 at 12:44 pm

Cerpintaxt

Oops! wrong spec

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0300000000000000000000000000320053303520031023000331013512302003050010000000000000000000&glyph=181312060501&version=10128

August 11th, 2009 at 12:59 pm

Cerpintaxt

omg im retarded CE not BCB!

August 11th, 2009 at 1:01 pm

Nimais

Hi SJ, I am currently using the SS based spec for Unholy dps due to lack of a 20% APR… I will be merging to the OB unholy or DW frost in the next few days. My guild relies on me on having top end dps, so my question is simple. Which of the two has proven in the past week 1/2? or which would have more potential?
I know you posted and commented on the builds when 3.2 went live, but have revisited them since. I don’t mind about the game play style or feel… I just want the most dps possible.

August 11th, 2009 at 2:10 pm

Skeleton Jack

Just got home – have not worked out yet – so you guys are gonna have to wait a bit still. Pwn was right, a lot of questions do get asked over and over again. Thanks man.

However there are a few new ones, so I will actually be needing to do a 3rd Q&A it seems.

These specs here are THE TOP 3 specs to run with. No questions asked. Yes, the OB Unholy beats the SS Unholy regardless of your APen. I got my teeth kicked in on that one, heh.

Now since I’ve been off of the P90X routine for over 2 months, I’ve gotta get back into it. Time for some self-inflicted physical torture.

August 11th, 2009 at 3:31 pm

Deafk

Just wondered if u had spent anytime looking at the Glyph of Disease at all, ive been testing it out with unholy OB Build and it does work well if u can squeeze in enough GCD’s

August 11th, 2009 at 4:15 pm

Groundtaster

Hey SJ,

I?ve posted before on this, but not sure if in the right spot. So I will make this shorter than my last version.

Before I start, just so you know, I have read all over your forums, as well as elitist jerks.

This is basically about blood presence vs.
unholy presence in the 51/0/20 blood spec.

Now already, i?m sure you are thinking i?m retarded and I should stop typing and use blood presence, no questions.

Now my question is why do i do WAY more dps in unholy presence than blood presence? I already know the saying, ?we?re dk?s, we hit hard, use blood presence? and i know all sites say to use blood presence.

On my server, a lot of ulduar 25 geared DK?s are getting beat by my dps without even gearing from any 10 man or 25 man dungeons. When they see me at the top of the charts (for example, 1 VoA 25 run), they check my gear and ask me my rotation.

We both (me and other dk in voa25) got our specs from your site. He used blood presence like your site and every other site said, i used unholy presence.
I had 8k+ dps going on emalon until we had to start switching to kill adds. My dps dropped to 6k by the end of the fight, being #1 dps with crap gear.

I had one dk that was doing 5-6k dps in a heroic, so i wanted him to try it out since he had better gear than me. Well on one boss he had 10k+ dps going and then boss moved for a while near end, dropping his boss dps at end of fight to 7k. That is amazing in a heroic.

So what i want to know is why blood presence is better when all the tests i have done proved uh presence won by far (short or long fights).

You can say i?m a retard or dumb or not doing something right, it doesn?t matter to me if some1 just says ?your not doing something right? or ?blood is better? or something like that, something that will tell me nothing.

I already know the common sense things like UH presence will do more on a short fight, and other things like that. and like maybe the other DK?s are just bad that i beat in dps.

But just FYI, i do basically the same rotation as you would in blood presence with unholy presence (51/0/20 spec).
I just want you to try it out, maybe it will work for you, i?m sure there?s got to be a few fights blood will do more in. All that i have tried uh presence and blood presence on. UH presence has won.

This topic was ignored on one of the other sites cause they went with the ?that?s what every1 has always done and not gonna change it? attitude.

I just want to see if anyone else can get the same results I got. Cause people freak out when i tell them what i?m doing when they ask how i beat them in dps.

So please don?t ignore this, at least reply and say i?m stupid so i know u read this lol.
Sorry for so long.

August 11th, 2009 at 5:01 pm

Rick

Groundtaster, thanks for sharing your experience to us, when i get home i will do some tests and post here

August 11th, 2009 at 5:22 pm

Groundtaster

thanks Rick

August 11th, 2009 at 5:30 pm

Nimais

I’m sorry if I’m insitant…

I get that OB unholy beats SS unholy. That being said, you had posted that DW frost was good if you wanted to sacrifice around 10% of dps and liked the rogue style feel; and on another recent post you compare OB unholy, DW frost and the blood spec, and it shows they are kinda the same.

My question is basically: Which do you think does more dps, DW frost or OB unholy?

Thank you for your hard work.

August 11th, 2009 at 5:47 pm

Groundtaster

@ nimais

From all i read, i can tell you that the blood and OB unholy specs do more than frost dw, blood does highest for me, but each person plays a tad different. OB unholy is funner out of that and DW cause you have more abilities u can use rather than just a rotation to worry about.

From my experience, frost dw is a little higher dps from rotations only. But nothing u can proc like gargoyle from unholy or dancing rune weapon from blood. so when those specs pop those, they beat frost dw. That’s just my observation on those. Just throwing my opinion around.

I saw a post where SJ put out a lot of guilds raids top dps and top 2 were blood dk’s…. go go blood dk. I just don’t see how u can beat the blood dk’s lol. Maybe aoe dps, but most people that i know care about boss dps.

August 11th, 2009 at 5:55 pm

RueRyuzaki

Groundtaster, Your stupid… LOL JK JK… i actully tried it out… i didnt get the same results u did with higher DPS… However, i did still do lots of damage… idk what it was u were doing but hey, if it works for you keep doing it lol…

also… mabey another thing is that ur “crap gear” may have had stats on them that help the UH Prez more than Blood… not really sure but just a thot…

August 11th, 2009 at 7:05 pm

Doug

Why no UA in either of the DW builds?

When used properly, surely it is more DPS than 3% crit on OB and BS.

August 11th, 2009 at 8:03 pm

ODk

in the past, before 3.1, i use to use unholy presence and beat every number i found anywhere when everything said to use blood presence, it was a frost build at the time and i believe as long as you dont have to pause pressing buttons, as long as you have a consistant string of GCD, you will prob most often do More dps with unholy than blood, but you will have to keep your rotation tight as possible (no lag between skills, GCD after GCD) – some people dont like to play that way and some just arent capable, but if it works for you and you have found a spec where your doing good numbers and not pauseing the skill useage in a fight at any time, i think that unholy is more fun and will be more effective (basically you lookin at an extra attack here and there rather than 15% … imho that 85% extra attack is prob happening more often than 15% damage will hold up if you dont have a space in your GCD’s) — atleast that was my take on it when i was out dpsing my self in unholy pres….also havin the free movement speed and insanely quick ability to dump your runes is so much fun…even more fun on AOE >> Empower rune weapon and blast 2 sets of runes down hehe

August 11th, 2009 at 8:16 pm

Groundtaster

thanks for the input guys.

@ Rue, i guess that is possible, but i don’t think it’d matter much between presence’s, it would matter more if different specs.

@ ODk, ya i’ve gotten it down where i rarely have any down time, i guess your right tho, 50% faster attacks/abilites with no down time is better than 15% more dmg with no down time, or one would think, but ya it’s definately working for me.

what works so amazing is after building the RP where DRW is up (blood spec), hitting death strike (making 2 death runes), then rune tap and another death strike, so all runes are blood or death, and hitting empower rune weapon with hysteria/trinkets up and DRW, it gets very nasty, and i always put my diseases back on right before drw goes away, applying 2 frost fevers and 2 blood plagues (4 total diseases). but ya, 6-8 heart strikes in a row (uh presence, making them all extremely fast) with drw up (with hysteria/trinket buffs) is unbeatable in my opinion.

once again, thanks for your guys’ inputs

August 11th, 2009 at 8:33 pm

Veldin

I asked this in a previous post but didn’t get a conclusion so I’ll ask again:

Blood 2H spec: For single target DPS, is Morbidity worth more than Ravenous Dead? Asking this because most sources point towards taking Ravenous Dead over Morbidity.

How much % of a DPS increase per point is Ravenous Dead (factoring in the ghoul damage as well, though it’s a small portion)?

August 11th, 2009 at 9:21 pm

zupa

Request:

MORE TANK INFO in particular TANK BiS list!

Thanks!

August 11th, 2009 at 11:50 pm

Knever

@ blood specs are better than frost DW…

all the dk specs really depend on procs…. so fight to fight its diff. I am Frost DW and have another dps blood knight in raid and we both do btwn 5.2k and 5.3k consistently. i am using a slow/fast combo (lack of decent dps slow) and he is using Ironsoul… both specs basically rock

August 12th, 2009 at 12:29 am

PoHuIsT

From all i read, i can tell you that the blood and OB unholy specs do more than frost dw, blood does highest for me. In blod i did 6.9k dps on boss , in frost dw i did 5.6k dps so blood iz the best

August 12th, 2009 at 12:29 am

axut

What glyphs will you use in Unholy OB?

August 12th, 2009 at 12:54 am

axut

k saw that u filled out glyphs in you specc so delete those 2 posts please

August 12th, 2009 at 1:05 am

ODk

@ Veldin — check elitiest jerks, you should find a list of the “Dps value” of your talents dependant on your main tree – could take some searching tho – make sure its not an old post before 3.2 too

@ Knever – slow slow is still better unless that fast you have is a good 15% more dps than any slow weapon you can get ahold of…

a good place to grab a good slow is out of H TOC, a great mace in there 163dps 2.6 speed for dual wield, its only 219 ilevel but easy as hell to get… lil harder to get but still easy to obtain is the Razorscale talon…

@Nimais – but ive also noticed it really doesnt seem to matter what spec you pick as long as its one of the top specs, its more how well you play that spec you choose imho… ive noticed sooooo many times after doin a pug raid that alot of the DK will end up in a block in recount, doing nearly the same damage, like 2nd 3rd 4th 5th place are all dk’s very close in damage, look at their talents and you see all 3, DW, Blood, and unholy…. (SS or OB too) and they are all doing decent from what ive seen…

ive gotten some great numbers with dw frost but more often than not lower numbers than if i play my unholy OB build, it could be because of some of my gear synergy (tho i have a good swapout for switching) or could be cause i have a 232 weapon vs DW 219’s – but i think the largest case is cause ive played unholy for a long time and its been awhile sense i prac frost, so im gona perform better with unholy until i spend some time on frost….. this is the case when just about anyone changes specs into soemthing they dont use often, your gona have to relearn it, your gona get low numbers to start, expect it….dont count it out until you have given it soem practice….

tho my frost numbers were so weak it just makes me want to give up before learning and try out blood which i have NEVER tried as a DK in the 10months ive been 80 (Bad DK, Learn spec first!!) – but atleast my ArP is over 20% now heh

August 12th, 2009 at 2:20 am

Amsterdoomed

Well guys to give my feedback i’ve been testing from start of 3.2. in 3.1 i was blood beast spec (as SJ) calls it.
Now i’ve been dw frost with UA and blood beast. Liek most of us know…. blood wins on big long bosses… period.

For both specs i didnt grab the best weapons I grabbed easy to get weapons, so to be fair to the rest of the DK’s I help on my server with my info.

Lately I been doing more and more dps with frost dw as i’ve been tweaking my gear a bit with gems and enchants.
Both blood and frost dw can hit 9k easy in 25 man XT and Hodir (with t7.5-t8 ish gear).

ALso keep in mind alot of dk dps is RNG and thus kinda dependant on procs. BUT again u can abuse this situation.
Think in the way of haste post and other cheap pots to boost dps for like 15 sec. These make big difference if u take it at the right time.

anyway SJ looking forward to tanking info sometime as I’m hitting a wall there >.<

August 12th, 2009 at 2:52 am

DonaldTrump

GCD’s Stand for ?
My assumption
“Global Coool Downs” Correct?
Just clarifing ???

August 12th, 2009 at 6:14 am

Soulscythe

Hey folks,

I got a question regarding dk dps, i am a blood dk and i should be able to pumt out maximum dps. however i am stuck around 1500 dps.
it sucks to see that low of dmg. i got dual specced tank (frost) and blood dps can anyone give me some advice? my character is soulscythe and it resides on the silvermoon server. All advice is welcome.

August 12th, 2009 at 6:43 am

DonaldTrump

Ok, UA Stands for ?

August 12th, 2009 at 6:50 am

SJ,
How about Some Info On new pvp Builds.
For us dedicated Dk’s that need our timeout to pvp & whale on some Enermies Butt. To release our frustrate of missing that 4th peice of tier8/8.5 to some blow in pug. that popped in on last few bosses, casue other dedicated guildies had to attend to RL stuff. Theres nothing I love more then whipping some butt to release my frustrations Of roling a 96 on my last peice of tier gear i needed, Only to some lame arse pug to roll a 97. /bashes head against wall./facepalm pug. yeh we’ve all been there.
So ,my timeout is hit some Bg’s.
But No serious understandably ur a buzy lil bee, But some pvp spec info would be sweet
Thx Bud…

August 12th, 2009 at 6:59 am

Vic

Ok
Could somebody please clarify GCD’s and UA Stands for ?
Still learning but this site helps alot.
thx

August 12th, 2009 at 7:08 am

Rick

@Groundtaster
in some tests as blood i couldnt do more dmg using Unholy Presence then Blood Presence, but as cited above if you do more dmg in this way just go ahead and do it

thx again

August 12th, 2009 at 8:52 am

Torgotson

Not really a comment as it is a request for advice. I am an UH Dk spec 23/5/43 and while I developed him to tank on occasion have had to dps with him and have very low dps output. I was wondering if you could give some advice as to a rotation that would work with this spec, as I have not yet duel spec’d him. I would like to thank you in advance for any assistance offered.

August 12th, 2009 at 4:26 pm

Billis

Re: Unholy OB build at the top.

Let’s say we don’t care about damage vs. trash in pve (or more accurately, let’s say we don’t mind losing some trash dps if it will benefit boss dps). Is Getting Subversion for 9% more crit on BS and OB (not to mention threat reduction) worth losing 1 necrosis and 2 Wandering Plague, making for 3/17/51?

Gracias Esqueleto Jaime.

August 12th, 2009 at 4:47 pm

Billis

@Vic and DonaldTrump

UA = Unbreakable Armor

August 12th, 2009 at 4:55 pm

RueRyuzaki

@ Vic and DonaldTrump, Again lol…

as statedd UA = Unbreakable Armor

and yes vic u are correct in ur assumtion that GCD = Global CoolDowns

August 12th, 2009 at 9:30 pm

Call me Crazy

Call me crazy but why wouldn’t you say http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0300000000000000000000000000320250003020000000000000000002302303030032152003150003103051&glyph=271808060504&version=10192 is the best spec for 2h Unholy?

August 12th, 2009 at 11:00 pm

lolareusure

http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deathknight=0300000000000000000000000000320250003020000000000000000002302303030032152003150003103051&glyph=271808060504&version=10192

Imo that should be a better Unholy 2H build than the one provided, any thoughts?

August 12th, 2009 at 11:00 pm

PoHuIsT

in dw i use this macro
#showtooltip
/castsequence [button:1] reset=6/combat Icy Touch, Plague Strike, Frost Strike, Blood Strike, Blood Strike, Howling Blast, Frost Strike, Obliterate, Frost Strike, Howling Blast, Obliterate, Frost Strike

iz this macro good ? or not ?

August 13th, 2009 at 1:58 am

Tom

Hello, just one question. i will use this spec 3/51/17 with Icy Talons an i have a question to the glyphe “Disease”. When i do the rotation the diseases are on the target and i want to have the icy talons buff when must i cast IT in the Rotation?
Can u please make a rotation with diseases and icy talons at all?
Another question…Pestilence spread and reset with glyphe…first reset and the spread new on the targets? Best regards

August 13th, 2009 at 7:04 am

Deathahl

Iv’e tried and tried your blood rotation on both single target and multi target but still i get way more dps with my rotation and i am almost always top on the dps charts, my rotation is DS, IT, PS, HS, HS – HS, HS, DS, HS, HS and then repeat, squeeze in DC whenever all your runes are on cd. am i doing your rotation wrong or can you test and see if you get more dps with mine? thx love your work.

August 13th, 2009 at 3:06 pm

RueRyuzaki

@ Deathahl

I tested ur Rotation (on single target only, didnt like the rotation flow personaly, so i didnt stick to it long) i didnt do nearly as much DPS as one stated… however, as said to anyone who does sumthing different than stated by SJ, “If it works for you, DO IT.”

if u can pull off higher numbers than anyone else, then yea… go with it dude… i mean… hell… if u pull 2k with this rot and 3k with urs… go with urs… simple as that

August 13th, 2009 at 9:11 pm

RueRyuzaki

hey SJ, i skimmed through past questions and didnt see this question anywhere… if i missed it srry… but just wondering about 1 “SMALL” (hehe) detail bout the 0/17/54 spec… it says BP > FF, just wondering y and if i were to switch it up and do FF first would it be killing me? id test it out but i just thot of that and im bout to head off to work…

thanks btw for all ur hard work

August 14th, 2009 at 5:32 am

Deathahl

hehe actually i pulled about 7k on patch 25 and 6.3 on patch 10 with the rotation also normally doing 5-6k+ dps xD but only reached round 4k with the other one, but i guess its how you say it, if it works for me i should stick to it.

August 14th, 2009 at 7:43 am

Groundtaster

once again

with the blood build, why not take the 3% strength (ravenous dead) from unholy tree?

51/0/20 spec that is….

August 14th, 2009 at 8:58 am

RueRyuzaki

@ Deathahl

lol i was just using 2k/3k as an example… yea ur numbers make more sense for the gear we are talking about

August 14th, 2009 at 2:58 pm

Aziera

For the glyphs are there any different options such as Glyph of Howling Blast instead of Glyph of Icy Touch. What I’m thinking is it would refresh my diseases for me so I dont have to use pestilence to refresh them so instead i do a damaging spell that reapplies them. Just wondering if my rotation with this would change drastically and if it would be worth it. Havent used my DK in awhile because I really only liked and knew how to play dual wield.

August 16th, 2009 at 3:59 pm

Aziera

oh i read the glyph wrong and for some reason thought it refreshed all diseases on the target not just put on frost fever xD

August 16th, 2009 at 4:27 pm

Hawtbeans

Well ive been checking around for Unholy 2h builds and the best ive come across is this one. http://eu.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=6&tal=0300000000000000000000000000320050003000000000000000000002302303020032152003150203133051

Plz gief some input on it;) Been going with blood for a while now and wonder who it compares dps wise

August 19th, 2009 at 1:44 am

Uthious

Hey SJ!
I tried out Frost DW in OS 10man… all i got was 2.5k dps. I followed your instructions and stuff. I think it would be great with a multi target AoE rotation aswell. Do you have that?

August 19th, 2009 at 2:19 pm

mat

I find the frost rotation impossible to follow.
Have you got any pointers on what i can do?

August 21st, 2009 at 6:59 pm

mat

Forgot to say:
One problem is that the diseases run out when you use blood strike before pestilence in that rotation, what happens if I use pestilence before blood strike?

I also find it very hard to keep track of when a KM AND a rime procs, and this is when im hitting the training dummy, can’t imagine how it would be like on a stressful fight…

August 21st, 2009 at 7:16 pm

Kaelus

So i am using ur DW frost spec – 3/51/17 and i have a slow/fast weapon set up. both are swords and i just got a nice 1H mace drop. i replace the main hand sword with the mace (which is also slow) and my crit drops to 5% from 23%.. i cannot figure out why. Would you have an idea why the crit drops so low?

August 28th, 2009 at 7:00 pm

e30Birdy

Mat get PowerAuras and it will pop up on your screen with either a symbol and sound or text and sound depends how you set it up.. i dont miss any procs since i have gotten it..

August 29th, 2009 at 5:25 am

jared

why the minor glyph pestiliance for 2h blood? i use blood tap for an extra HS and use that for a minor glyph

August 29th, 2009 at 5:32 pm

Kamn

Hey I love your sight and its my DK bible. one thing though, before i was recommended to your site i was using a 15/13/43 unholy spec. after coming to your site and using your OB unholy spec im not dpsing like my old spec. pls email me with any questions bout glyphs sigils and rotations and see if we can work on something new!! thanks again and keep up the great work

September 3rd, 2009 at 4:41 pm

kokay

Hey, I play a Blood DK and my dps is around 4.7k – 5k dps bit epic achive gear. It says that unholy is better with OB but i only crit for 4k with OB and with a heart strike 7 – 10k (on bosses) is it woth to try unholy and see if my dps with rise? i’m 50/0/21 atm… can anyone help me?

September 7th, 2009 at 1:14 pm

Skullcap

kaelus- ur wep skill in maces is probably low compared to swords. easy fix.

September 7th, 2009 at 8:29 pm

Uthious

Got my problem sorted, but i wanted to know more about the new Sigil. Sigil of Virulence. Would you recommend it for Frost DW?

September 14th, 2009 at 1:01 pm

Asperon

Hey skeletonjack. I’m trying to find a dps spec for my dk to give more than 2.5k dps and for some reason it doesn’t work. Here’s my character and spec and gear so please send me an e-mail on what to do. Or if anyone else can help out it would mean a lot.

September 29th, 2009 at 3:11 pm

Deathcarrier

A spec i use as 2hand is 44/0/27 ( http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#jfVMVh0Icfof0sZZfM0hxcdx0z ) its realy good actually cause when you spec Unholy Blight it will also make your HS’s DC to do Unholy blight on secondary target and the other things in unholy just increase damage. The Ghoul did i spec cause there wasnt anything else, and it supports with damage alot. I do recomand this spec if you wanna test something new thats good. =)

October 3rd, 2009 at 5:39 pm

Richie

for the 2H Unholy Obliterate 0/17/54 you suggest to use the Pestilence glyph, yet Pestilence isn’t in the suggested rotation(s) or is PS Pestilence, not Plague Strike?

cheers

October 5th, 2009 at 9:51 pm

Ben

I’m trying the DW Frost. Done everything you’ve said to do, I have the two slow maces from H ToC, and a gear score of 2500+, but I can’t come up with your numbers. I’m only hitting 3-4K dps. Is there anyway you could look at my toon and tell me what I need to change? I can email you all my info. TY.

October 6th, 2009 at 6:49 pm

Sinareus

this is my spec it gives the 20% haste to melee and still dose good personl dps http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Sinareus&group=1 only time you will use howling blast is after 2nd obliterate OR when rime and howling blast prock. This is my 1 butten macro to go with it. /castsequence reset=8, plague strike, icy touch, obliterate, blood strike, blood strike, frost strike, frost strike, obliterate, obliterate, obliterate, frost strike, frost strike,

October 30th, 2009 at 12:46 am

Sinareus

after reading my post i see i did not make something clear you only use howling blast when you get the prck for it. only place to use it without the rime prock is after the 2nd obliterate. now if you get the rime prock and the howling blast prock you fire that off right away then back to mashing that butten

October 30th, 2009 at 12:58 am

onelvlhigher

actualy what i didnt see on here is the HS spam rotation were you (idk the numbers) put talents in unholy till night of the dead is maxed then go all blood rotation is :
Pop CDs (ghoul, army, hysteria,HoW)
after that its simple DS>DS>rune weapon(if avalible)>HSx8 repeat
i get about 9k dps with this

i also disagree with the blood warms eating up raid heals they dont give you enough health back to actualy do much and are good to have for the damage the provide no matter how little or how much it may be

December 8th, 2009 at 1:41 pm

onelvlhigher

upon reading my comment i should add i can get 9k usualy on tank and spank such as ony p1 but usualy from runnig around and such only getting 7-8

December 8th, 2009 at 1:44 pm

Skeleton Jack

3.2 DK Spec Updates for PvE DPS

2H Unholy Obliterate – 0/17/54

DW Frost - 0/53/18 & 3/51/17

2H Blood - 51/0/20

Rotations

Other Useful Info

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