20
Jan

Best Frost Spec and Rotation in 3.0.8

   Posted by: Skeleton Jack   in Rotations, Specs

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Heya guys!!  So 3.0.8 hits live today, and I’m sure there are a ton of things you’re curious about.  So I’ll start you off with the top end Frost DPS spec and rotation.  Interesed yet?  ;)

So if you noticed an earlier post I talked about how I did about 3k DPS on PTR in a Frost Spec.  What is relevant to this?  I also did the same as Unholy on PTR and Live (pre-patch) 3k DPS on a test dummy as well.

Now while raid results will vary with buffs, debuffs, encounters, and more…this is indicative that the end game dps potential of both Frost and Unholy similar.

17/50/0

This is the base spec that I used.  This leaves 4 points that you can honestly spend however you like.

I personally dropped the rest into Blood so that I could pick up 1/3 Veteran of the Third War.  How you spend the 3 points to get there is up to you, but the best choice is probably into a tanking talent (if you do so) or into Rune Tap for healing (which is probably a more effective choice for dps’ing).

Now the interesting thing to note is that my dps results are skewed.  Merciless Combat icreases your damage when the target is under 35% health, and as it so happens the target dummy was at 1% health the entire time.  So once you calculate that in, it means my real damage would have resulted in roughly 2800 DPS.  Still, more than close enough to 3k DPS to be noteworthy.

Where is the upside?  I never used ERW once, I did not upkeep HoW, nor did I ever use Unbreakable Armor.  So in actuality the DPS should have been slighly above 3k because I was not even self-buffed like I should have been.

The only true downside to the spec and rotation available to Frost is that there is no way to truly “ramp up” your damage outside of using Raise Dead.  Your damage will be consistent and constant the entire way through, and then get some bonus damage from Merciless Combat when the target becomes low health.  Whereas Unholy and Blood have Dancing Rune Weapon and Summon Gargoyle as well to ramp their damage up in certain encounters.

Rotation

(Use Blood Tap before the encounter starts to gain a Death Rune)

IT -> OB -> OB -> BS

That’s it.  I’m serious.  When you get to the end of your rotation you fire off Howling Blast if Rime is up, and then fire off Frost Strikes.  Remember that if a Rune comes off of CD and you then activate it 1-2 seconds just after it becomes available, it will start it’s CD count at that number.  Meaning, if it becomes active and you fire off a FS at that second, and then use that Rune the moment after, the Rune will begin it’s cooldown at 8 or 9 seconds, not 10.  Feel free to test this out on a dummy and you will quickly learn how to use this to your advantage.

Never change the rotation order.  If you do, it will possibly use the one Death Rune you will have per rotation on a Blood Strike instead of on an Obliterate like you need.  If you ever mess up your Runes you can do one of two things.  You can either pop Empower Rune Weapon to bring everything back online and start over, or just use a IT -> PS – > BS -> BS -> OB rotation to get it to where you can use your Runes as needed on the next go around.

Also it is important to note that Unbreakable Armor will give you +10% Strength for 20 seconds every minute.  This is not just a tanking ability, but a DPS one as well.  Every minute (or 6 rotations) make sure you fire this off during the FS phase of a rotation.  This will give you a DPS boost.

You always want to burn off enough RP that you will not hit your RP cap (120 for this spec) during your rotation.  So if you messed up your rotation and you only have time for one FS, that is ok so long as you won’t go over your RP cap when you finish your new rotation.  Delay the new rotation if you have to so that you will not break 120 RP.

A standard rotation should then generate 79 RP, or 99 RP per rotation (10 seconds).  This means that you need to either be under 41 RP without 4/5 T7, or under 21 RP with 4/5 T7 before you begin your new rotation.  It is important to note that this spec makes your FS cost 32 RP.  So if you have 4/5 T7 and you fall into a 22 to 31 RP range (where you cannot use FS) that you will lose some RP. 

If you chose not to spec into Blood for Veteran of the Third War and you instead put a 3rd point into Runic Power Mastery then you can increase these values by 10 RP for more leeway (making it possible to never “waste” any RP).  In the end however VoTW is a an overall DPS increase over RPM.  It is only worthwhile to pick up RPM if you really wanted to spec into other talents such as Hungering Cold for PvP or farming related reasons and don’t have the gold for constant respecs.

Now the big question you are probably asking this entire time is:

“WTF IS PLAGUE STRIKE!?!?!”

You will never use this ability or Blood Plague in a top end Frost build.  The rotation is very tight to begin with, as you’ll see when you try to fire off HB and use up all of your RP with FS’s at the end of a rotation.  On top of that, working in PS’s will lead to less total OB’s being used.  In the end, working in the PS will cause an overall net dps loss.  Weird I know, but true.  So as a Frost Knight, you will avoid this attack entirely for Boss DPS.

AoE

Now as far as AoE is concerned everything changes of course.  While Obliterate and IT are the clear winners in a ST DPS race, AoE brings Plague Strike and HB back into contention.

IT -> PS -> Pest -> DnD (Spend Rime proc/RP on FS if possible)

HB -> BB -> BB -> HB (sub OB when HB is on CD/RP on FS if possible)

You get the idea from here on out…

Other Specs

Are there other viable Frost Specs?  Sure.  But I’ve not listed them here because this is a post about the “Best Frost Spec and Rotation in 3.0.8″.  :P   And I will be putting out more “Best Spec” posts for 3.0.8 before I ever work on sub-specs available out there.  Raid viable specs for buffing and debuffing count as sub-specs.  This is just about the top end dps here.  I still have to get back to BISI posts, so posts about sub-specs will come later.  :P   But for now, it’s time to get ready for work.  Catch you on the flip side.

-Suffer Well Brothers and Sisters.

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This entry was posted on Tuesday, January 20th, 2009 at 9:35 am and is filed under Rotations, Specs. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

36 comments so far

Spek
 1 

So with the new patch does this mean the 31/40 or 32/39 specs are no longer the “best” ?
Im just curious because i want to increase my dps but i want to know if i should stay DW 31/40 or switch to 2h 17/50?
Hahaha i know you aren’t done coming out with specs, but im really anxious to get back on the servers and pwn :P

January 20th, 2009 at 9:56 am
Skeleton Jack
 2 

This isn’t saying this is the best spec for DK’s, it’s saying it’s the best Frost Spec. DW Spec, Blood Spec, and Unholy Spec are coming still. Patience young padawan…

January 20th, 2009 at 10:03 am
ukasz
 3 

Personally I believe 1 more expertise, +8%str and +10% ap to raid to be better than +10% damage to skills only.
spec: http://tinyurl.com/a25vfp

btw, nice rotation, I shall test it tonight

January 20th, 2009 at 10:15 am
Schwarzenaga
 4 

I <3 Frost.

I was frost all the way from my baby days in Acherus till I hit the grown man level of 80.

Tried out 17/0/54 unholy and 0/32/39 DW, but for some reason, I could not get the proposed results that everyone was getting (followed rotations as said, I’m geared appropriately, runed appropriately, everything was in line, but no go), so back to 21/50/0 frost for me!

January 20th, 2009 at 10:19 am
Skeleton Jack
 5 

Again, this is the post about the “BEST FROST SPEC”. This isn’t the post about the best raid frost spec, the best DW frost spec, etc… Hence I said in the post:

“Are there other viable Frost Specs? Sure. But I?ve not listed them here because this is a post about the ?Best Frost Spec and Rotation in 3.0.8?. “

January 20th, 2009 at 10:26 am
Pwnisher
 6 

I’m really starting to wonder if something else is going on. We added a pug DK in a 10 man who was 17/0/54 like me, same raid buffs, but I had better armor and stats like str, hit, crit, and haste. We both had the same titansteel destroyer in hand. This dude was consistantly hitting 3.5 to 4k dps per encounter. I was so pissed! We compared notes on rotations and such after the raid and there was no difference. He also does not use macros. My question to the wow community is WTF? Check out Pwnisher on Zangermarsh and tell me I shouldn’t be doing more than 1700 to 2100 per encounter. My gut is telling me that something else is going on to balance party dynamics or whatever. I have 10 witnesses to this raid two days ago and everyone is scratching their heads. Dang, my spec on the armory may be messed up…I may have logged playing with new specs… Armory is down, so can’t be sure. PEACE

January 20th, 2009 at 10:32 am
Desespoirs
 7 

@Pwnisher : according to what you wrote, there is a major flaw somewhere.
You checked rotations and template, and they are the same. OK, even though your raid would have gained more benefit from an alternate spec (like blood for AP boost and slight life regen, or Frost for Improved Icy Talons, depending on what you may lack).

It’s difficult to say w/o your templates and gear at that time, plus a wws record, but for me, this looks like you failed at using some high-DPS tools from UH build : Gargoyle, UB and Ghoul.

Do you start fight at the same moments, or do you wait more ? Is this overall DPS for the whole raid, and you died a couple times (and not him) ? Is there any encounter inducing a flaw in DPS record (ex : if you control an add on Razuvious and not him) ?

But difference is huge : even Ghoul + Gargoyle forgotten does not lead to a gap of 2k DPS …
My recommendation would be fro both of you, if possible, to spend some time on a training dummy and compare. The immediate next one would be for you to respec, to bring more to your raid … ;)

Good luck !

January 20th, 2009 at 10:58 am
Kuergen
 8 

looks to be a fairly nice Frost spec, I may have to try it out when my DK gets to 80 in the next few days. What glyphs were you specced with when you tested it ??

January 20th, 2009 at 11:14 am
Pwnisher
 9 

Thanks for the response. I absolutely use ghoul, garg, ub. Our typical rotations for that raid were ps>it>pest>dnd>ub etc. Both in at the same time skull, x, diamond, etc. Recount reset after each encounter. He just kept lol because of the consistent ~1k gap per encounter. I will get you his toon’s name tonight when I get home from work. Great suggestion to hit the dummy together – will pursue. Still, this dude hitting 4k+ at every turn had our guild in awe. To see his stats below mine made me look suspect in some way. I read and read and try really hard to stay atop the food chain and this guy claimed to have gotten the spec from a guild mate and casually clicks toolbar buttons during each mod encounter. /pissed

January 20th, 2009 at 11:20 am
Todesritter
 10 

SJ Thanks for spending the time to get us a solid Frost rotation. Hopefully I can still hold onto Unholy.
~So now we got a huge guy theory, and a serial crusher theory. Top notch.~

January 20th, 2009 at 11:37 am
LePeR
 11 

@Pwnisher

Are you both exactly spec’d the same because that would mean you both took ebon plague and therefore whoever gets it up first will gain the benefit and any other unholy dk’s will not because it’s pretty much bugged where it cancels out the effect for others

January 20th, 2009 at 1:32 pm
Tasian
 12 

Nice Post. Im gonna have to give it a try and see it if worth swiching from DW 32/39 DW.

January 20th, 2009 at 1:32 pm
David
 13 

I tested a similar spec on PTR and its really pretty bad…its not even close to the best Frost spec (not to mention there are multiple blood and unholy specs far superior). heck the old 0/44/27 was significantly higher dps than this spec on PTR.

January 20th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
Ebonproxy
 14 

SJ,

I’ll be doing 25Nax tonight, I’ve been lucky enough to find a really good raiding guild that lets me fill there spots (Tanking or Dpsing) Which ever they need. Since I’m the red headed step child (Not in there guild, belong to a small pvp friends guild that doesnt raid) I spec to which ever they need.

I use your information here to show them that I am one of the few DKs that do not fall into the “Deathtard” catagory. Because of your helpful information I’ve been able to stay withen the top 5 when I’m dpsing.

Thanks again for your site man, can’t say it enough: You Da man!!!

P.S. If I get to dps tonight I’ll be using your spec here to try it out. One question I have is would it be the same/better/worse if I slid into DW with that spec, just changing a couple of minor things?

January 20th, 2009 at 1:45 pm
Skeleton Jack
 15 

David

Nice to see trolls alive and well. I provided Recount dps numbers, explanations, and detailed instructions on how to make this work. And meanwhile proved that it is near in line with Unholy, when I have done 5k+ dps with Unholy repeatedly (with SS’s to prove it). I’ll trust my research and my proven testing over your “say so” any day of the week.

As to DW specs, those are exactly that. DW specs. They are *NOT* Frost specs.

Kuergen

If you look closely at the Spec, it has the glyphs listed on that page.

January 20th, 2009 at 2:44 pm
Phinks
 16 

SJ,

I’m loving your site so far :) But I’m just wondering as to what glyphs/enchants/gems you would recommend while using this frost spec. I will most likely be throwing the extra points into Rune Tap to increase survivability that little extra.

As for gems, I have been stacking Strength, but am curious as to see what you think about the meta gem. Is the 42 ap worth getting, or should I go over to 21 crit. The problem is with crit is that I need 2 blue gems, and cannot find anyone with Sovereign gem with +8str +12 stam. Heard its not even in the game yet. Do you know if this gem is implemented in this patch?

Much thanks to your effort in this website. I just discovered it yesterday and will be using it plenty.

January 20th, 2009 at 2:48 pm
Kuergen
 17 

thanks SJ, noob mistake on my part

January 20th, 2009 at 3:24 pm
Dagon
 18 

I’ve been unholy spec all the way up to 80 following your best dk leveling write up that i found when i first started my dk.

I have been waiting for this patch to come out before i re spec for raids. Would this frost spec be good for raiding? or should i just wait for a another write up?

January 20th, 2009 at 3:31 pm
Creep
 19 

Hopefully a best ‘Dual Wield’ is on the horizon too. ;)

I’ve gotta get my DK ready for some Dual Wield action pretty soon, heh.

January 20th, 2009 at 3:48 pm
Beta
 20 

Wouldn’t you want to put in 3 to
http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=50034

so that it’s easier to recover from broken rotations.

I don’t know about you all but when I’m running around, which is 80% of the time I’m always off my rotation.

Anyway, just a thought.

January 20th, 2009 at 4:03 pm
Skeleton Jack
 21 

Glyphs: Go look at the spec again.
Enchants: FC on weapon, outside of that you’ll have to wait for BISI.
Gems: Go take a look back at BISI and the hit/Expertise post linked there. Hint: BISI is on the top of my site.

DW: Coming soon, yes lil lady. ;)

Beta: Did you read the entire post? Seriously? I left 4 points open for you to spend where you like. Put them into Blood, or into Frost, whatever. :)

January 20th, 2009 at 4:22 pm
Phinks
 22 

Ty, sorry I found the glyphs right after I posted that :P

January 20th, 2009 at 4:40 pm
Galf
 23 

Hey SJ, me again. Just curious if I could get your email for some complicated questions. Either posted here in the comments or emailed to me. Thanks and hope to hear from you soon.

January 20th, 2009 at 4:40 pm
Ebonproxy
 24 

~drools~

15 mins till its time to head to the house and I…CANT…..WAIT….lol todays been a total waste. I can’t focus on work because I keep messing with the talent meter, googling difrent wow threads and so on and so forth.

Oh OH OH looky there 12 mins left. hahaha Cya in the battlefield!!!

January 20th, 2009 at 4:44 pm
proximous
 25 

Thanks SK ….

January 20th, 2009 at 5:12 pm
Deathbloom
 26 

I found this spec and rotation a while back on another site, and I’m kinda pissed that you are telling everyone about it!! J/K, I love the info on this site. I was #2 in 25 man Naxx last week, with ok gear. Second only to a DK with your 17/0/54 spec and better gear than me. I like the simplicity of the rotation, it is very forgiving (especially if you spec into Death Rune Mastery). I get a good thrill of running up to a huge mob and popping all my cooldowns along with a IT>Pest>HB crit. Love the site, keep up the good work:)

January 20th, 2009 at 7:18 pm
vitium
 27 

why not use HB instead of one of the OBs? on most of my parses, it seems to do more dmg than OB…

only thing i could think of is if you have the naxx sigil i could see how that might make a difference

January 20th, 2009 at 7:36 pm
veranai
 28 

hey might i suggest useing HB instead of DnD. my dps is up by quiet a bit useing that isntead especialy when you get your rime proc up or even deathchill

January 20th, 2009 at 10:09 pm
Creep
 29 

wewt, thanks SJ.

January 21st, 2009 at 3:28 am
Fulleclipse
 30 

I tested out this spec last night in 25 man naxx, and i was pulling 3k-3.2k dps. I went nd swapped to blood and was puliing 3.5k dps so very good spec if you like frost i dnt think up to par with blood or unholy but i believe Jack said that lol.

January 21st, 2009 at 9:51 am
Deathbloom
 31 

With Glyph of Obliterate, even without the Naxx Sigil, Obliterate does more SINGLE TARGET damage than HB. This wasn’t the case (for me anyways) before the patch change of the Glyph. I noticed in 5-man heroics last night that my OB’s averaged more normal and crit damage per hit. This was not the case (for me) before the patch. Not to mention that OB was critical hitting at a stupid rate of 75%. Here’s the thing, on bosses that do not have adds (read Single Target), OB is more dps. But of course on any multi target situations even without Pest HB will give you more DPS. And when you do use Pest along with trinkets, procs, and Deathchill… Who doesn’t love a 12k+ HB? In 5-mans my FS, OB, and HB all crit for over 7k and all crit over 50% of the time with ok gear. I’m lovin it!

January 21st, 2009 at 12:10 pm
Will
 32 

I dont normally make posted but i wanted to say that i tried out the frost spec last night made some new glyphs and OMG i loved it!, it was crit, crit, and crit. I have always been unholy since wrath started, and always top dps so i was worried about going frost in the first place, but i tried it in our 25man naxx and wow it was awesome, i noticed that if i can keep the rotation going without messing up its a huge dps increase (that was the challenging part) my friend who has always been blood copied the spec and tried it and was like “oh Hell yeah I like this!” we both got rune mastery which helps alot with the rotation, then of course veterian of war. But anyways Thank you Skeleton jack awesome spec, think i may stick with this one for awhile lol

January 21st, 2009 at 2:56 pm
Jess
 33 

So, ive been hearing rumors about OB being bugged right now. Is there any confirmation to this said rumor? Would the dmg be more higher once it gets fixed.

January 22nd, 2009 at 5:55 pm
Skeleton Jack
 34 

I’ve not heard anything about Oblit being bugged out, but I’ll keep my eyes open.

January 23rd, 2009 at 4:41 pm
Sçhecter
 35 

What do you do if your MT is a Frost DK who already has Imp IT and Frost Aura?

January 26th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
Hellsheart
 36 

I tried out the AoE DPS rotation and for some reason, I couldn’t get it to work for me that well. Diseases kept falling off long before I was able to get my HBs off. So I came up with the following rotation:

IT -> Pest -> HB -> FS till Runic Power is gone -> HB -> FS -> Repeat

I could get two HBs in before the disease fell off thanks to the new 5 sec cooldown on HB and when Rime procced, it let me toss in an Obliterate for free. This rotation is more for killing one mob quickly while widdling down the others. Throwing in a Death Chill before using HB is nice, too, with no GCD.

January 29th, 2009 at 9:55 am

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